Troops out of Iraq call from the man in charge of the British Forces -

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6046332.stm

The head of the British Army has said the presence of UK armed forces in Iraq "exacerbates the security problems".

In an interview in the Daily Mail, Sir Richard Dannatt, Chief of the General Staff, is quoted as saying the British should "get out some time soon".

Ben

Edited to add - But by acknowledging that we make the situation 'Worse' if we do not withdraw, then it can only be perceived as 'Political' and not strategic/military reasons that keep us there - in other words it's to suit the politicians - and no army should be in that situation. That's my opinion anyway.

I can't wait to see what the Bush admin says about these remarks. Gen. Richard Dannett has brass, for sure and my admiration May it help get the troops out of there.

This story will be interesting to watch and find out more about. I wonder what led up to having such a prominant leader announce that it's past time to go?

Mary

Well even if we pulled out now anyway (including the Americans), it would make little difference, as we already have our puppet government in there doing our bidding anyway.

Back down now and you send a clear message of resignation...

Don't back down and more of our people die for what? A political statement? Surely our troops are worth more?

Ben

Its gone beyond a political statement or move for oil, Ben...you know that now...we cant help what its become...all we can do now is fight what it will be tomorrow...surely this world is worth more?

Tutu, what has it become? I'm not sure what you mean? Like, east-vs-west out in the open after centuries of dishormony?

Mary

I see where you are coming from now and have some sympathy with that but the type of war our troops are engaged in there is not one we can win....don't fight them on their terms - fight them on ours....

Ben

All has degenerated into a cesspool of religious fanaticism...give in to the fanatics and you might as well burn your charters of human rights and freedoms right now...they will not stop Mary...

And what are our terms, Ben? They will not contain themselves to their own borders...and nevermind those they hold captive within to their own genocidal murderous atrocities..

Okay, thanks, I see what you mean now. Yes, I certainly think things will get a lot worse than they are now, in many nations, past behavior indicating future behavior and all. I'd think somebody up there has plans to get out of Iraq and do something somewhere else...as well as plans for what to do if troops stay in Iraq. It's all bad, so to speak...will get more hellish and costly as days go by, worldwide.

Mary

The price of freedom can not be calculated for it is paid for in human lives. We have crossed the point of no return. There is no way out. Sorry for my fatalism but that is all that I can see.

I agree - but (and correct me if I'm wrong on any point please) - we cannot win the type of warfare we are confronted with now....we cannot hold down afghanistan, Iraq, be ready for Iran, keep an eye on North Korea and possiboy intervene in Darfur all at the same time - we just can't. So what to do?

We can turn our backs on the Muslim world and tell them to sort it out themselves and defend our turf at our own borders. But as you rightly say they will penetrate and when they do it will hurt us badly....

Immediate pragmatic resolution to take the pressure from our troops and free them up for elsewhere would be to split Iran in two - Sunni's in one state and Shi'ites in the other - the effects of the current civil war would subside enough to allow both states to regain control for themselves....

We then TAKE afghanistan by force - I don't mean install a new regime - I MEAN TAKE THE GODDAM PLACE and run it as an American/UN satellite - we then tell the rest of the Arab world 'Fuck with us and this will be your fate'.

Ben

Where do I re-enlist?

I'd say get those out who desire it...then disable their infrastructure...then leave them to it...a house divided can not stand...let them blow each other to hell and back

I think you're old enough to remember the USSR trying to do something like that. I don't think that panned out.

Exactly... I so agree with that statement 22...

This will sound murderous, I know. For a global economy/community to prevail, we must ‘polarize’ the world. All nations (major world players) in. No hold-outs. What is happening right now is illuminating those nations who want to play by their own rules. Regardless of the consequences to Humankind as a whole. These nations, if left to their own devices, will present a threat to Global Peace.

No ‘easy’ choice here. Leave them alone, they’ll ‘bomb/terrorize’ any nation they become ‘pissed’ at. Make no mistake, these nations (who will not hesitate to finance/arm terrorists in order to further their own agenda) will not ’care’ if they murder 20 million civilians. I think the present ’crisis’ goes way beyond any religious fanaticism. It’s about ’independent/sovereign ’ power and a nation saying to the World, ‘We are a sovereign nation, we will do as we please! No one will dictate how we choose to act in this World. We are Sovereign!”

Wish I could think of a better solution though…peace and love~rore

I choose my side Ro, for all it's faults, I'll take the secular democracy of the West over the fundamentalist despotism of Islam...

Askep posts:I choose my side Ro, for all it's faults, I'll take the secular democracy of the West over the fundamentalist despotism of Islam...

It's not 'all about' religion skep. I choose the Global Community also, but I miss my friends that have died furthering this concept and I know more deaths are to come...for me, this is not an 'easy' choice...peace and love~rore