Here's a site that tackles the questions regarding religious diversity and tolerance.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/rel_plur.htm
22, Opal, Dross, Andpau, Trog, Rose, Hodge,Ariane, KorMan (yes...even you, asshole)and affa(also asshole...lol...)Dingo, Webmajick, Greeneyes, Rich, Boon, Vet, Lona...Ben ((sweet, dearest brother, Ben! Come back soon!))whoever, newbies.....
I'm awfully confused.
As a Christian, I believe the Christ will be seen at the transition from life to death, regardless of religious affiliation in life.
I believe (and this is just my personal theology....not mainstream at all) that some will embrace this spirit....a spirit of love and life and continuance and faith (although they might never have identified themselves as "Christian" or "Jewish" or "monotheistic" or even "theists" at all) by any means in life.
But some will hide from the ultimate light of truth, in shame (although they might have considered themselves good Jews or Christians or Muslims or whatever) and those that find themselves hiding from love and goodness will simply be given what they want... aloneness....separation... Hate.
What I'm really wondering, to you good people of this forum, is whether or not I'm displaying a subtle ethnocentricism in my belief that "my religion is right, and you'll see".without being able to see my belief as such.
I'm not a "hell" believer...I think this life is much too "hellish" on it's own to warrant an eternal "hell"....but I do believe love and peace are life. Truely and deeply I believe this. And I see this in Jesus, amongst other historical figures.
To any of my forum friends....please respond. Am I a conceited Christian, or am I possibly on to something, in spite of my being a Christian, or is hate and killing just a realistic part of being a human....or am I making things too black and white...or am I just delutional...or whatever?????

Nah, you're not a conceited Christian. I may not agree with you about Jesus or God, but I do agree with just about everything else.

I just think reality teaches us that we come from a mother and father and all that is living teaches propagation and reproduction. We are replicas. We start with a cell and the cell replicated into us and each of us are unique but similar to our parents and they too are similar to theirs. Life teaches life. Many of us refuse to see life's beginning so they will also refuse to see its end. There is an end in change, in death hings change even existence shows us this. So just how marvelous is the chanage of the human at death? Humans are marvelous in life; we are above all other life forms in capabiliities. Doesn't reality, therefore teach you that our change at death must be equally marvelous? (Without the scriptures; life teaches you)

Death isn't the end; it's a new beginning.

Hey, Lona...we've missed you...

kellyb
I'm displaying a subtle ethnocentricism in my belief that "my religion is right, and you'll see".without being able to see my belief as such. To any of my forum friends....please respond. Am I a conceited Christian, or am I possibly on to something, in spite of my being a Christian, or is hate and killing just a realistic part of being a human....or am I making things too black and white...or am I just delutional...or whatever?????

I'm not exactly sure what the actual dilema is... I think...... Faith and what you believe in spiritually.... is a personal thing and something which doesn't need to be justified to either yourself or anyone else really.... You simply believe what you believe.....

But.... if for example... we all said... yeah kelly, you are being biased and ethnocentric and you are wrong to believe what you believe... would that really instigate an inner change of belief and faith within you? Would it alter how you feel... And if it did alter how you feel... would that not be a sign that your faith is shaky in the first place and that what you believe in isn't as strong a faith in you as you believe your belief is... Arhhh... love those verbal doozers.....

Does it really matter if any of your beliefs are biased? Example... if you believe your belief is per chance ethnocentric... why would that matter... Just a few tossings...

Dingo
:goblin:
.

Well, Dingo, with spirituality often comes a sort of spiritual eliteism...like a transcendental snobbery, or something, you know? Most religion is guilty to some degree, but Christianity is particularly bad about it. I hate it when I see it in others, which, in a way, is the first step towards it in a weird way....
I dunno...it's hard to explain...

kellyb
Well, Dingo, with spirituality often comes a sort of spiritual eliteism...like a transcendental snobbery, or something, you know?

Yes.. I see what you are alluding to now... a sort of a cock sure attitude... or being too cocky as we call it here... a visual display of so called 'arrogance'.... Our cockatoos... or cockies as we call them.... bob up and down and get that puffed chest strut like you see in roosters when something goes their way... a pride in their achievement and that doesn't mean it's a bad thing does it?

Or like some blokes do after they make a good pool shot... Okay.... in some cases that would be a genuine 'ego' thing... But I also think in many people it isn't an elitist thing.. It's simply that they are self content... self assured in that they have a truth which they believe in and have faith... more like a security in their life... simply pleased with themselves... pride... and is that wrong?

Most religion is guilty to some degree, but Christianity is particularly bad about it. I hate it when I see it in others, which, in a way, is the first step towards it in a weird way.... I dunno...it's hard to explain...

I don't think it's religion which produces this... it's the people's attitude's and reactions which would be what brings this about... Even so... there are many people who have faiths and beliefs and in many cases you would have no idea what these beliefs would be by observing their outward behaviour... I also think how a person reacts could be also have something to do with cultural upbringing... as in, how obvious this is...

Some cultures are naturally more humble in cultural personality and public 'displays' than other cultures... so some would 'stand out more'... simply because people of a similar culture mostly share similar spiritual beliefs... And western white man who would be mostly Christian is more 'showy' than say a more reserved eastern Buddhist believer... ???

I dunno... just thinking some more... before the next step.... I know what you mean there... I think.... hmmm... Okay... I did ask... if you thought it was purely a self 'spritual ego' thing in your case and not just a inner peace and contentment... what would you do about it? My post before this one asks the questions...

Dingo
:goblin:
.

Kelly B

Hate and killing are not natural parts of the human psyci in my opinion...it's something born by outside sociological causes..and in some inatances a chemical inbalence of the brain.. People kill because they believe they have been wronged they have no choice....they are hurt they have overreacted...all kinds of doctrination ..many reasons but rarely just because they were born too

Kelly...what you are seeking is an answer that none here can give...not even you can answer the question you pose...faith, dearest and closest to our soul, is a lonely thing...unlike other things such as love and happiness, there are none outside of our own selves who can validate what we believe is true...the loneliness drives us to seek out companionship and acceptance, if not validation, in others...we feel our faith is strongest and, perhaps, true when it is shared among the group...in the churches and synagoges and halls...but when we sit alone and gaze up at the distant heavens and their immense timelessness reduces our whole being into a insignificant speck or we kneel before the cold stone of our beloved's grave...we wonder and waiver and despair...what truely lies beyond the veil? Is our love, so freely given and deeply felt in life, done so in vain? Does the darkness forever sallow up our loved ones whilst they pass from our existence like a breath of air...forever gone...all in vain? It is in the still moments of our soul...the silence between the beats of our heart...that our faith, so rejoiced over in the comfort of the church pew, becomes a heavy burden...

There is no answer here...nor will you find it in Holy Books or freverent congregations...no answer can be given...and I mean that to say that the answer to your question can only be felt...when those quiet moments come upon you...stop trying to believe what you think you should believe or what you want to believe...be still and there you will feel the true faith...not of your own will or making...but simply a part of your own being...and this is the wordless language of God..

That was beautiful, 22...geez...you should be a poet.

Nah...I've always felt that while words, when spoken or written from the soul rather than the mind, can express the highest human ideals, they themselves still fall short of divinity...the are no words in the tongues of men which can capture the essence of God or Spirit, though some may move us to tears or rapture...and while I am an avid lover of literature and poetry, I have never found much solice or strength in the so-called 'Word of God'...it always seemed to me to be such a debasementof the intangible essence of God, something which may only be felt and never spoken...what does the 'Good Book' teach me? Valuable lessons in virtue? Surely. History? Certainly. Faith? Not even close. One may argue that the Bible certainly teaches faith in eternal life and love...but I would argue that it is simply a guess...man's vain attempt to encapture the wisdom of God already wrote upon the soul from the moment of its conception...what need have we of shallow words when that which assures of eternal life is an inseperable part of our very being? Could the Eternal Creator have made us any other way when we are made of the same nature, the same substance, of the Creator itself? When the Creator is everything and all that has ever been, could we be of anything other than the Creator's own essence?

What part then does Jesus play in our eternal life...what need would we have of a savior? I can only say to you to look past all the words printed in the Holy Books, close your ears to the sermons you hear...and do the thing which Christ instructed you to do...be still and there in the silence, you will feel God...for as Jesus was but a man and a child of God...so are you...you are one in the same...we are all the children of God...all created from the same Creator...whom is everything...God does not speak to us through written or spoken words but rather through wordless feeling...you will feel it...the unfathomable awe, the immense love, the wholeness, the eternal continuinity of life...and while still bound to the physical perceptions and barriers of the mortal self, the soul's relationship with God is innately private and intimate...shared only between the two...much like the unborn child in the womb in its relationship with its mother...its God...did not Jesus instruct you to go off by your self, in seclusion, when you pray? Jesus knew and he suffered the wrath of the public displayers of religion and bore the agony of the cross just because he tried to impart this wisdom...to remind us all what we are...and though the thought of it bears the loneliness which I spoke of earlier in my last post, this passes once you become truely still and awaken to God within, for as everyone is of God, through God, we are all connected, every soul to its brother and sister,in the womb of God, waiting to be released from the mortal self, shed of the human conception of time, and born into the life of pure Spirit...where there is no percieved seperation from self and others and God...and that is, in itself, a cycle of birth and rebirth...in time, leading us back to where we first began...

Truely, Kelly, we are lost...we have forgotten what we are...so much so that it would seem that we have become something entirely different...what we once were has become, to us, nothing more than a half remembered dream...a shadow left behind...some struggle to remember...to search the books and faces of congregations...while others simply choose to forget...but all, it seems, deafen their ears to truth of the matter...which Christ spoke so eloquently of...that the way back is not without but within...

sorry for the rambling post

22

:angelwing
the words you speak are righteous. may the force be with you.

on the topic.
however personal and privat christianity is ( I talk only about christiansn since I have no experience with another religion and I would like to concider myself christian) there are rules. Rules made by somebody else, that may not suit you.
not talking about the 7 sins or 10 commandments but practices held in churces that you are expected to participate. And if you don't you are a bad christian ( ???? whatever that is supposed to mean)
I believe in God, but I don't think he will punish me just because I had a beer or because I did not sing in the church. He will see me and my heart not what is shown outside, isn't that one of the main points.


:confused: srry if abv makes little sense but I'm still figuering out this issue

FA...lol...the 'Force' is probably closer to the truth than we realize...or remember

And I agree with you...religion is made by mankind for mankind...God or Spirit has no need of it...Jesus Christ did not create or found Christianity...his disciples did when they ceased to be students of the Master and became worshippers, inventing a deity which the humble Jesus never claimed for himself and enshrouding the simple truths, which Jesus tried to teach to the masses, in new religion...yet all you ever need to know in this mortal life is evident in your eternal soul...

22

do you believe in eternal soul ?

all things you do and feel in this life will be transformed to everlasting"energy"...

hmmmmmm.....makes me want to be better man.

FA...I dont believe that the soul could be anything but eternal...

How do you know the soul even exists, though?

Kelly...if I were to tell you that I have irrefutiable proof that you do not exist, would you believe me? Could you believe me?

Lol...no, but that's really not the same. What makes you believe in the soul...how do you know? I'm not talking proof...just...ummm....well...something...

it goes back to what I said earlier...quiet your mind and be still...do you not feel your 'self'? That's your soul...you just know it and feel it...none or nothing could convince you otherwise...and it is exactly the same...you are your soul...not your mind or body...